There's another thread on Lambda the Ultimate which I've been following with some interest. Unfortunately it seems to have degenerated into a static- vs. dynamic-typing flame war, which happens all-too-frequently for my taste.
It's quite a shame really, because I think the functional languages community and the dynamic languages community have a lot to learn from each other. (And since we're all outcasts from the mainstream computing world, we ought to stick together.) These are a few thoughts I've had about why the two groups communicate so poorly.
First, I think there's often confusion around terminology. In particular, the static/dynamic and strong/weak typing dichotomies are often conflated.
Labelling a language as statically- or dynamically- typed refers to the way variables are treated during compilation. In statically-typed languages, the compiler attaches type information to variables, and uses that information to catch type errors and perform optimizations. Compilers in dynamically-typed languages treat variables simply as named references to values, and leave it until runtime to determine how to perform operations on them.
The strong/weak dichotomy refers to how values are treated at runtime. Strongly typed languages attach type information to values, and programs cannot alter those types, while weakly typed languages treat values as "bits in memory" and how those bits are treated is largely a convention.
Programming languages are often either weakly- and statically-typed (eg, C++) or strongly- and dynamically-typed (Smalltalk), which may be one of the reasons for confusion.
Another thing that seems to enter into these debates is perspective. They often have the feel of "mathematicians vs. engineers" or "theory vs. practice". The exchanges end up being endless repetitions of, "Static typing guarantees that you won't introduce certain kinds of errors," which is rebutted with, "Yes, but it also guarantees that I can't get my work done easily."
Dynamic folks like to take a gardening approach to programming. They're up to their knees in the mud, hands dirty, planting and pruning, swatting bugs as they appear and composting weeds for fertilizer. They view the system as a living, evolving thing, and value testing, feedback and iterative development for figuring out what works and what doesn't. They don't worry about ensuring that everything goes right from the beginning, because a little pruning or landscaping can fix any problems that come up.
Static folks, on the other hand, take the architecture approach. They sit at a drafting table, and design structures of concrete and steel. They view the products of their work as monuments which must withstand the pressures of time and work hard to imbue them with mathematical grace and harmony. They know that structural failures can be catastrophic, so they build safety into their designs from the beginning.
Ok, maybe I went a bit overboard with the metaphor, but I hope this illustrates the different perspectives I'm talking about. Being a Smalltalker, I tend to prefer the iterative approach to development. Or rather, having learned the hard way that I can't plan for every eventuality, I appreciate that Smalltalk lets me quickly develop possible solutions, gather feedback and begin the cycle again. That said, I also appreciate the utility of the mathematical tools used by the functional programming community. What I want is a system that combines the agility of Smalltalk with the robustness of, say, Haskell.
And there's no reason the two need to be placed in opposition. Strongtalk was a great example of dynamic system that allowed rapid development, yet also provided tools for performing static type analysis in order to catch errors. In addition, the Strongtalk VM did optimizations based on type information gathered at runtime, which eventually wound up in Sun's HotSpot Java VM.
Frank Atanassow has promised to write up his take on the whole issue, in a paper called "How to argue about types," which I figure will be quite interesting as a reasonable view from "the other side."
Posted in compilers